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JoRoan Lazaro's avatar

Fair pin, and you've kind of got me. The new ones do sit on both sides of it now. Thanks for firing up my Sunday morning brain! Let me try take it on your terms instead of mine.

Of the three doors you offered, "substrate, stakes, something I'm missing," It's the stakes, and underneath the stakes it's cost.

The I-Thou doesn't turn on whether address happens. It turns on whether the address costs the one giving it. There's only a second party in the room if your walking away could hurt them. And the machine does answer back. It tracks you, remembers, shows up at whatever time of night you need. But... it loses nothing when you go. So it isn't the other side of the relation. It's a really good reflection of your side.

That's also why the boy isn't me cheating by using a sad story. He's like the criterion with the noise pulled out, not an end run around it. No machine intelligence. No warm feelings getting in the way. Just 'someone' spending real attention on a body that could never pay it back, for no reason except they wouldn't stop. He isolates the one variable the 3am case hides, which is what's being spent.

A functionally complete simulation can do everything except be made to have paid something. That's the whole difference, and there's nothing under it.

AG's avatar

Pushing on this in good faith, because the Buber frame is carrying a lot and I'm not sure it holds. You define aliveness as conferred by address, but address is a two-place relation, and the newer systems now occupy both seats. They're addressed and they address back: they query my state, retain it, and respond contingently at 3am. So if the I-Thou structure is what confers life, and the machine now sustains both sides of it, what distinguishes "real" care from a functionally complete simulation of it?

The boy is a gorgeous case, but he reads to me like an argument from intuition rather than from the criterion you set up. Genuinely curious where you'd locate the difference. In the substrate, the stakes, or something I'm not seeing?

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